On this episode of Faith and Reason, the panel discusses Pope Francis' death; his legacy of confusion, heterodoxy, and division; the upcoming conclave; and more.
(LifeSiteNews) — On this episode of Faith and Reason, John-Henry Westen, Father Charles Murr, and Frank Wright discuss Pope Francis' death; his legacy of confusion, heterodoxy, and division; the upcoming conclave; and more.
The panel opened the episode by discussing the sudden death of Pope Francis on Easter Monday. Westen asked Murr how he, as a priest, felt upon hearing the news that the Holy Father had passed away. The priest emphasized that, more than anything else, he felt "relieved" that this pontificate was finally over, later clarifying that this doesn't mean he's judging the state of his eternal soul.
"These have been very difficult years, these last 12 years, for me as a priest, because I'm trying to bolster other people who are very upset with this whole scenario, with this whole pontificate," the priest said. "However, I was relieved because it's finished."
OBITUARY: Pope Francis has died aged 88
Murr recalled some of the most controversial episodes of Francis' papacy, including his contradicting the faith and suppressing traditional Catholics.
"The lack of mercy, the revenge in many cases, vengeance in certain cases, throwing religious out of their homes. You know, he left a lot of people homeless for no apparent reason," he said.
"And just so many wrong things, the wrong teaching in the faith, the Pachmama thing, I will never get over that ... it was sheer idolatry, and to see the bishop of Rome involved in idolatry was something I never thought I would see."
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Wright echoed Murr's sentiments that Francis made many traditional Catholics feel homeless during his pontificate.
"And it's a sense of great sadness for Catholics worldwide, who I think have been left with a sense of homelessness throughout this pontificate," he said. "That is simply the legacy that is left behind after Francis."
"[The Church has seen] an uncertainty that really doesn't belong in the Catholic Church," he added. "And it is this legacy that struck me when I heard the news, that it's such a deeply sad time for all the wrong reasons. And that sadness, I'm afraid to say, hasn't ended, and the crisis in the Church hasn't yet ended."
READ: Bishop Schneider urges Pope Francis to 'retract' texts undermining the faith
Westen urged listeners to pray for the Holy Father's soul.
"The understanding that hell is a real thing did get me to pray very earnestly that Francis had an opportunity to repent," the host said. "No one wishes for anybody to be in hell. If we knew the reality of it, I think that you wouldn't wish on your worst enemy."
Later in the episode, the panel turned to the upcoming conclave, with Westen noting that many of the cardinals, like Pope Francis, have contradicted the faith. He asked Murr about the possibility of one of these men being elected pope. Murr underscored that there are indeed several cardinals who have embraced heresies that were not called out under Francis' Vatican.
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"We do have a number of cardinals - this is amazing to have to say - who really are heretics, and they've embraced heresies of all sorts," the priest said. "No one has called them on that. This is supposed to be the business of the holy office of the [Dicastery] for the Doctrine of [the] Faith. They're supposed to be called on these things so that they don't get this far out of line."
Murr stressed that if one of these heterodox cardinals is elected at the conclave, there could be a schism in the Church.
"We [could] really come down to facing a schism in the Catholic Church. This is really what it comes down to," he added. "Either way, whether a good Catholic man wins the election or a Francis 2.0 wins the election ... I intend to stay in the Catholic Church."
For more discussion on the death and legacy of Pope Francis, the prospect of a heterodox cardinal being elected pope, and more, tune in to this episode of Faith and Reason.
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